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[Tom]

Okay, I get it. EZKeys is just another piano instrument with a midi library. I somehow forgot this because yet another sampled piano just don’t create a lot of interest. What sets it apart from the others is the midi library. And now some claim the library is too small.

Personally I can live with a small midi library. The good thing is that I can extend it myself. That’s the most important thing to me. It has been stated that Toontrack will look into improving chord sequencing, and that is what I am waiting for.

Whatever Toontrack’s initial intentions were, may I just suggest you look into developing this kind of instrument as a sort of BiaB replacement working directly with user recordings in a DAW: Chord sequencing and ability to drive other instruments aside from piano. Then you can sell library add-ons in different styles, just like you do with drum midi and EZMix stuff.

Best of all would, of course, be something working like Jamstix with musician models or the way Jammer Pro/BiaB can compose with an element of probability, transitions etc. But I realize that is a much more demanding task to take on, so I will be happy with just midi libraries as long as I can enter my desired chord sequence.

[Tom]

I have to disagree with the original poster.

It is not a question of what EZKey is and could be. It is so little we are asking for: Make it possible to enter a chord sequence and then have the midi variations automatically adjust to that chord sequence when dragged down into the songtrack.

This small addition would make EZKeys really versatile. At present it can be used for putting pieces together much like audio samples. Fair enough if that inspires your songwriting. But most of us already have written the song with chords and all, an now we just need to add a piano player. And that is where EZKeys doesn’t work well. Yes, you can do it, but everytime you want to audtion another variation you have to enter you chord sequence once again. Very time consuming.

… and if EZKey could also be used as a midi plugin, you could even play organs, synths, strings and whatever through Kontakt or another sampler.

[Tom]

I just hope it won’t take as long for “retaining chord progressions” to be implemented as it took for EZMix to go to version 2 before meaningful descriptors were assigned to the knobs…

There is an alternative to EZKeys which will work inside a DAW. It is called Rapidcomposer. I have the LE version. It is very capable, but also has a steep learning curve which combined with a high price and the lack of a decent manual makes it less interesting. I am sure Toontrack can do better.

I also have Jammer Pro which has a vst plugin that will make it work with some DAWs and some OS, but a bit clumsy. In fact I have all the arrangers out there, but none works fine inside a DAW. So just make EZKeys deliver. I think you are close, but the few things lacking are unfortunately also crucial.

[Tom]

Okay, maybe I just wasted my money buying this. I have for a long time hoped for a vst plugin working on a single instrument roughly the way BiaB does standalone. I also do the singing and everything that looks remotely like a guitar myself. Drums I do with Jamstix/Superior. So what I need is something to do the keyboard stuff.

Alas, I compose my songs with a fixed chord sequence. And as this thread demonstrates it is a pain to have EZKeys add the keyboard instruments. So still waiting for someone to write such a vst.

[Tom]

I will try to explain, but a demo probably shows it better.

In BiaB you enter the chords for a whole song. In the simplest example you choose a style to cover the whole song and all instruments (both can be changed, of course). Now if you don’t like the style, you just try another, and it will still play the song with your desired chords.

In EZKeys you only have a single track for a single instrument (piano). You can’t enter any chords beforehand. But you can drag different vaiations down in the track. These variation will cover maybe 4 bars and comes in different BPM, style for verse, bridge, chorus etc. You can choose a key, but other than that the variations will come with their own chords. Could be like C, G7, Dm, C. Once in the track, however, you can change those 4 bars to C, Am, F, G, if that is what is needed in your song.

The problem comes if you don’t like what you audition. As soon as you drag another variation down in the track it will bring its own chords and once again you have to enter C, Am, F, G.

In BiaB you probably sometimes try out 10-15 styles to get what you want. Now imagine having to do that and change all chords in the song back to what you want in EZKeys? But since you can actually change the chords after the insertion of a variation I don’t see why EZKeys shouldn’t have the option to remember your preferred chords before the insertion and then automatically change to give you those chords. That’s why I think it only requires a small change to EZKeys to give us what we want.

[Tom]

I don’t want to be to negative about EZKeys, though. I actually think it could be what I (and you) wanted: a BiaB replacement for single instruments working from inside your DAW. It should only take a few programming tweaks to get there.

1. Make it possible to enter and lock a chord sequence (the BiaB way) in the song track. So that any variation dragged to the song track will play along with these chords, rather than us just having to adjust this manually every time. You could even enter the chord sequence automatically by importing a full midi track. EZKeys already has this great option, except you can’t “lock” the analyzed chords in the song track.

2. Give us a midi output. Then we can route to Kontakt or other instruments to get something else than the EZKeys piano. Again having to paste manually to a midi track just to auditon is too cumbersome while you are trying out different variations/instruments.

With these two small changes I think EZKeys will be worth the money. So don’t dispair Toontrack, you could have this ready for us next week in version 1.02. In the longer run it can then be expanded with more instruments with more midi variations. Just like your other EZproducts. We will be hooked and buy all the time.

[Tom]

As a Band in a Box user you should be warned about EZKeys. It sounds like you jump to the same conclusion that I did. And that conclusion was that EZKeys was a kind of BiaB, but for a single instrument and also working as a vst from inside my DAW. If true it would have been great. But it is not.

You can’t enter a chord sequency like C, Am, F, G and then drag the variations down to play along those chords.

What you can do is drag down a piano variation that comes with its own chords like C. G7, C, G7. First after that is it possible to change the chords to your liking. So okay, you make it C, Am, F, G. Done.

… Well, as it happens you don’t like that variation in context with the rest of the song, so you drag down another variation to try out …. Oooops. Now the chords you changed take on those coming with the new variation. Once again you have to change back to C, Am, F, G. Step by step. And so it goes for every variation you audition.

It is obvious to me that it would take a Toontrack programmer only a few hours to change the program so that chords can be locked to bars, and piano variations dragged on to bars will play along with user chosen chords rather than their own chords. So come on Toontrack and do this. That’s what I thought I bought. As for pianos I already have several better.

[Tom]

I know, but what I am talking about is auditioning from inside EZKeys while composing an instrument to go along with other tracks in the DAW. I can’t keep copying and pasting to tracks in the DAW just to hear what it sounds like in context with a different instrument.

If EZKeys worked as I believed it did when purchasing, I could just have the sequence of chords corresponding to the melody in the DAW inside EZKeys. I could then pick various clips from the browser and move them down in the song track to hear how they fit in the whole project. And if midi was output I could even hear how it would sound with another instrument like an organ.

Presently the whole workflow is slowed down. As soon as I pick another clip to audition the whole chord sequence is lost. I have to put it right again bar by bar, and finallly paste the whole thing into a track in the DAW to hear what it sounds like with organ. Then start all over again if I don’t like it.

Compare to how you can audition various styles in Band in a Box by just double clicking another style. It was something as easy as that I believed that EZKeys could do. But no.

[Tom]

I am somewhat disappointed in EZKeys. I had thought it worked like Band in a Box and similar programs, but for a single instrument and as a vst directly in my DAW.

But no. There is no way to enter what chords I want for a song. I can move a clip from the browser, but it comes with it own chords. I can then change them to fit my song. But as soon as I move another clip into the same space in the song track it will change to its own chords, not the ones I want. So I can start all over again … So how can I quickly audition what sounds best to add to my song.

Analyzing an imported midi track is great. But again, the should be an option to keep the chords and the have a clips dragged into the song track adjust to the chords of the imported song so that you could quickly add a piano.

Also, EZKeys should be able to output midi so that I can change to another instrument in say Kontakt, perhaps even an organ or a synth.

These are the two major disappointments to me.

[Tom]

In that deleted thread I wrote:

To start with something positive. Yes, I like EZMix 2 better, first of all because we now have a meaningful description of what the knobs do instead having to find that info in a text box and then translate it to a fix knob name.

That said I also think the right side looks like a toy shop. I would have preferred just a text description here, or at least something looking like a rack rather than messy shelves.

Also I happen to prefer faders to knobs. They are easier to adjust. But thanks for being able to adjust the knobs with the mousewheel. That facility always earns an extra star in my user reviews.

– – – –
With this addition:

If showing the hardware in visuals is a Toontrack thing, then at least make it possible in the next .1 version to turn of these visuals.

[Author]

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