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[jgro002]

I read a previous thread where someone noted something similar about the “Camco & Craviotto jam” on the C&V demo player (i.e. that they couldn’t get ‘that sound’ with the effects in Superior Drummer 2). The answer there was that the mix for that demo was done with the original C&V using outboard gear – perhaps this is the same situation?

Jeremy.

iMac 3.06 GHz 4 GB OSX 10.6.5, Focusrite Saffire 6 USB, Logic Pro 9.1.3, Lacie D2 Quadra

[jgro002]

+1

I think the Evil Drums pack is the most realistic sounding of all the SDXs (just beating out C&V) – I’d love to see the Andy Johns pack for Superior 2.

Cheers,
Jeremy.

iMac 3.06 GHz 4 GB OSX 10.6.5, Focusrite Saffire 6 USB, Logic Pro 9.1.3, Lacie D2 Quadra

[jgro002]

Thanks for the replies,

Scott – yeah it’s definitely more prevalent in some SDXs. For instance, I’m working on a track with kit 3 of evil drums and the kick is clearly on the right and snare clearly on the left when soloing the room/oh mics. I actually kinda like hearing the snare ever so slightly off centre, but not the kick. I think that’s a good idea to narrow the panning of the overheads/rooms, although do you then find you have to alter the panning on the close mics too? (i.e. so that you don’t start ‘smearing’ the image of the toms/cymbals etc?)

Chris – it’s only when soloing the room mics on some of the SDXs that you can clearly hear snare/kick off-centre. But when the close mics are also playing back the effect is very, very slight, and in a mix probably a complete non-issue. I was just curious what others thought of this. Cheers for the input.

Jeremy.

iMac 3.06 GHz 4 GB OSX 10.6.5, Focusrite Saffire 6 USB, Logic Pro 9.1.3, Lacie D2 Quadra

[jgro002]

All I saw of interest was a Youtube video about ‘Metal Month’ (November) when apparently Toontrack will be releasing four products aimed at metal. The vid didn’t say anything other than that. The video was called something like ‘Toontrack metal month teasers’ if you want to look for it on Youtube…

Jeremy.

iMac 3.06 GHz 4 GB OSX 10.6.5, Focusrite Saffire 6 USB, Logic Pro 9.1.3, Lacie D2 Quadra

[jgro002]

They are both pretty awesome, but I think it might depend a little on personal preference, and what you want/need from your drums. Have you listened to all the demos? Also try to listen to some of Joe Baressi’s work such as Bad Religion, Rancid, Tool etc to get an idea of his vision.

Here’s how I’d break it down:

Metal Foundry – Pros: Great selection of drums to choose from. The cymbals sound particularly awesome. The room sounds great IMO though I’ve heard a few people say they don’t like it. The ambience certainly sounds very ‘real’ like the kit is in the room with you. The options you have in the mixer are insane, for instance from memory you have 5 snare mics to choose from! As far as the detail of the way they sampled the kits I’d say Toontrack took it to another level when they made this library.
Cons: I just don’t like the way the kits are tuned. The kicks are fine but for me the snares are tuned way too high. The snares are all attack and no sustain or body. Arguably you could go into the envelope section of Superior and fiddle with the sound there, but for me there is simply not a single snare in the bunch that I like. For a really dense mix they may be perfect though, but I write more kinda ‘metal ballads’ and they just don’t sound right to me. The toms on the other hand are tuned pretty low, which once again doesn’t do it for me.

Evil Drums – Pros: I think this is the most ‘real’ sounding of all the libraries, which to me makes it probably the best library. It really sounds like drums in the room with you. You get 6 kits to choose from plus 6 extra snares and 6 extra kicks, so a HUGE selection of drums in this package. The mixer presets from Rail are AWESOME, very useable with only minor tweaking to fit your particular mix.
Cons: Seems to be the most demanding in terms of ram usage of all the libraries so make sure your computer is up to the task…

Jeremy.

iMac 3.06 GHz 4 GB OSX 10.6.5, Focusrite Saffire 6 USB, Logic Pro 9.1.3, Lacie D2 Quadra

[jgro002]

Hey,

I just looked on the Toontrack site and it was 89 Euro on my end too…I’m in New Zealand

Jeremy.

iMac 3.06 GHz 4 GB OSX 10.6.5, Focusrite Saffire 6 USB, Logic Pro 9.1.3, Lacie D2 Quadra

[jgro002]

When you said ‘softer song’ this is not what I imagined I was guna hear!!

Awesome job though man. I think the lyrics work really well with that heavy sound.

Cheers,
Jeremy.

iMac 3.06 GHz 4 GB OSX 10.6.5, Focusrite Saffire 6 USB, Logic Pro 9.1.3, Lacie D2 Quadra

[jgro002]

Cool, thanks guys.

iMac 3.06 GHz 4 GB OSX 10.6.5, Focusrite Saffire 6 USB, Logic Pro 9.1.3, Lacie D2 Quadra

[jgro002]

Hi,

I don’t have any experience with the EZXs so I can’t shed any light there.

As to a must have SDX, what sort of music do you make stylistically? I find all the SDXs to have different ‘flavors’ – certainly you could use any of them in multiple genres but arguably certain SDXs lend themselves more to particular styles than others. Here’s my take (bear in mind this is partly objective and partly subjective):

New York Studios Vol 2 – in my opinion has the best room sounds of any of the SDXs (although I haven’t tried Music City). The Allaire room in particular is just stunning. The kit pieces are a bit more varied than what comes with the Avatar kit too. So you get these big rooms with different kit pieces but recorded by the same team that did Avatar so it still sounds like it ‘fits’ with Avatar. Great for anything ‘rock’.

If you want something that offers a very different sound to the New York stuff (for some variety) then C&V would be worth a look. It’s a much drier sound (not much room) but still has a nice ambience to it, really great if you want a more ‘intimate’ drum sound or more retro feel, compared to the more ‘big rock’ sound of the NY stuff. The drums themselves sound amazing to me – in my opinion this expansion is the one that makes me say “man, that is a beautiful sounding snare” or “wow, that’s an amazing sounding kit”. This SDX to me is about drums sounding great as an instrument rather than just as a production value, if you understand what I mean

The metal foundry – requires more work ‘massaging’ the drums than the other SDXs IMO (because the drums are unprocessed) but means you’ve got the ultimate control to make it your own sound. Also good for styles other than metal, but requires a lot of mixing. Great sounding cymbals in this one, and lots of kit-pieces to choose from.

Evil drums – sounds kinda like a rockier version of C&V. Really amazing sounding drums there and 6 kits to choose from!

Hope that helps you to some extent. Honestly, I don’t think you can go wrong with any of them but it’s hard to say which is a ‘must have’ without knowing your musical tastes. For me I think my favorite is C&V, and it provides a very different sound/feel to Avatar which can’t be a bad thing (variety).

As for the midi, the Songwriter’s DrumPack is awesome IMO.

Cheers,
Jeremy.

iMac 3.06 GHz 4 GB OSX 10.6.5, Focusrite Saffire 6 USB, Logic Pro 9.1.3, Lacie D2 Quadra

[jgro002]

Anyone?

iMac 3.06 GHz 4 GB OSX 10.6.5, Focusrite Saffire 6 USB, Logic Pro 9.1.3, Lacie D2 Quadra

[jgro002]

Thanks for the reply.
 
I have the Songwriters Pack (which is excellent imo) and have used the half-time grooves for a couple of tracks already.
 
I’ll have to get Music City at some point.
 
Cheers,
Jeremy.

iMac 3.06 GHz 4 GB OSX 10.6.5, Focusrite Saffire 6 USB, Logic Pro 9.1.3, Lacie D2 Quadra

[jgro002]

Thanks for the replies guys.

I knew I’d be told to ‘use my ears’ lol!

Scott, I’d already heard those mixes on another forum and been very impressed with how the EZmix version sounded relative to the mix done with waves(?) plugins.

And that’s a good point Chris (or is it Mr. Whitten? ) – I’m sure EZmix is capable of some real magic when used in the way you describe.

Cheers,
Jeremy.

iMac 3.06 GHz 4 GB OSX 10.6.5, Focusrite Saffire 6 USB, Logic Pro 9.1.3, Lacie D2 Quadra

[jgro002]

Hey there,

Until someone from Toontrack answers your specific question about that particular demo I’ll give you my perspective. When I was looking to buy the C&V SDX it was the very same demo that impressed me the most. And let’s just say I wasn’t disappointed in any way when I finally got C&V. It quickly became my favorite of all the libraries.

The C&V SDX is really, really great sounding and comes with some excellent presets from Peter Henderson. Included in those are two that (from memory) are called ‘Open Oaklawn’ and ‘Vintage Oaklawn’ which should pretty much get you that sound. Not sure if that would be what they used for the demo or not, but the point is that you have a bunch of presets that are ready to drop into a mix.

I’m also on Logic, and there’s nothing wrong with Logic’s Eq and compressor should you need further processing. Hope that helps some.

Cheers,
Jeremy.

iMac 3.06 GHz 4 GB OSX 10.6.5, Focusrite Saffire 6 USB, Logic Pro 9.1.3, Lacie D2 Quadra

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